tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post1959080397901321602..comments2023-12-09T07:21:51.160+00:00Comments on The Druid: Fighting for Anglesey: The REAL reason for Plaid's poor election results (hint: its wasn't because of the Leaders Debates)Paul Williamshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01021606156107333019noreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-78878033911176233532010-05-20T21:13:31.789+01:002010-05-20T21:13:31.789+01:00A comment from Dylan Rees about 15.51 above would ...A comment from Dylan Rees about 15.51 above would be appreciatedAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-58786021937592221882010-05-20T09:13:04.162+01:002010-05-20T09:13:04.162+01:00The answer, Anon 17:35, is that we will never know...The answer, Anon 17:35, is that we will never know the answer. Niether the WAG nor any other public service organisation keeps a count of the cost of bilingualism although, where translation is subcontracted, there may be a cost recorded for accountancy purposes.<br /><br />Bilingual provision of services is a legal requirement of the 1993 Welsh language act and therefore not an "added" or separate requirement but a necessary part of the service.<br /><br />You may ask what would happen if the requirement for Welsh language services continued to dwindle so that the small demand experienced now became almost non existent.<br /><br />The answer to that is.... no difference. There is no way back from a Welsh language scheme that aims to provide services or run organisations "Through the medium of Welsh".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-60856907049214332832010-05-19T17:35:56.699+01:002010-05-19T17:35:56.699+01:00At last a bit of sense
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/h...At last a bit of sense <br /><br />http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/wales_politics/8692117.stm<br /><br />if that saves £250,000 a year how much could be saved by not producing everything in English and WelshAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-88195645210586989922010-05-19T15:51:32.676+01:002010-05-19T15:51:32.676+01:00On the subject of Plaid, I have always been told t...On the subject of Plaid, I have always been told the party is there for Wales and encompases Wels, English and the speakers of other languages.<br /><br />I think NOT SO!<br /><br />After the election count in Llangefni, at the time the candidates spoke from the platform, Dylan Rees used not one word of English or any language other than Welsh. I have often met Mr. Rees and on first impressions found him OK but sadly he will now never attract my vote.<br /><br />SaddenedAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-24752225095392421602010-05-18T14:37:54.458+01:002010-05-18T14:37:54.458+01:00Anon 12:54 - I never remove post for their politic...Anon 12:54 - I never remove post for their political alignment - only those which are overly derogatory or offensive as I don't think they helpful in generating discussion. I also would prefer not to have to delete any.Paul Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01021606156107333019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-73093072092088164132010-05-18T13:15:46.837+01:002010-05-18T13:15:46.837+01:00How many extremists are well-balanced individuals?...How many extremists are well-balanced individuals? By definition they are not.<br /><br />Give them a voice, but don't let them shout the place down.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-83971156731896244502010-05-18T12:54:14.985+01:002010-05-18T12:54:14.985+01:00It seems that Welsh Grumblings is upset about some...It seems that Welsh Grumblings is upset about something. Personally I think that the Druid already deletes too many posts. Granted some are intemperate and some have contained racist language that I have'nt seen since the early sixties but that indicates a type of person and a strongly held belief. <br /><br />Where do you draw the line? If you are a Tory (as the Blue Druid is) do you remove trenchant anti Tory posts? If you are a Plaidophile do you remove all posts that indicate a dislike amongst some people for Culture and Language Nationalism?<br /><br />Come one, come all I say.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-7823052688816188652010-05-18T12:45:47.122+01:002010-05-18T12:45:47.122+01:00Jim is correct although the left of centre stance ...Jim is correct although the left of centre stance of Plaid was always only a way into the Labour fortress of South wales and the valleys.<br />Plaid can only shrink in its heartlands because its cultural conservatism alienates too many of the people.<br /><br />By stabbing their coalition partners in the back so often Plaid may have shot themselves in the foot. I see a return to strength for Labour whilst Plaid, who only a short while ago refused to reject the possibility of an alliance with the Tories in Westminster, are going to pay the price for their squalid manoeuverings.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-76140790833357818462010-05-18T12:12:50.013+01:002010-05-18T12:12:50.013+01:00Plaid are finished as a political force in welsh p...Plaid are finished as a political force in welsh politics.The new english coalition is set up to be the most unpopular government for the last 50 years,but their extremism will result in the Welsh embracing the Labour party and not Plaid.<br />The reason is quite simple,Plaid in power have done little other than to emulate New labour.Plaid now consists of a whole raft of career politicians who present as just another boring political party.They have failed to stimulate the welsh imagination,and have also proven by their avid support of the badger cull that they are willing servants of the farming lobby.Plaid has become right of centre,and on many policies far right of centre.How can they possibly say the represent the people of wales.<br /><br />JimAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-29187165924453171712010-05-17T16:52:33.915+01:002010-05-17T16:52:33.915+01:00Welsh Rumblings chooses to misrepresent fact repea...Welsh Rumblings chooses to misrepresent fact repeatedly in order to justify his position. A sober, objective reading does not support Rumblings increasingly hostile and bilious posts. <br /><br />Plaid Crashed and burned. Get over it. Move On.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-55279708897969385582010-05-17T16:05:29.288+01:002010-05-17T16:05:29.288+01:00@11.14
I didn't say that he refused to speak ...@11.14<br /><br />I didn't say that he refused to speak to me in English what I said was that when he realised I wasn't a welsh speaker he was dismissive and couldn't be bothered, which is true.<br />For the record I was born and brought up on Anglesey and have never moved away, been here over 50 years now, am I a lesser person because I don't speak Welsh, I don't think soAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-80095315322012662702010-05-17T14:10:28.996+01:002010-05-17T14:10:28.996+01:00Ramblings: apologies for a late reply, I've be...Ramblings: apologies for a late reply, I've been away.<br /><br />"Didn't take long for a Plaid analysis to descend into an anti-Welsh diatribe did it?" <br /><br />I don't see the point in censoring opinions/deleting comments unless they are exceptionally offensive or derogatory - of which I occasionally receive a few both anti-English and anti-Welsh. I think its better for everyone to acknowledge that there are people out there living in Wales who have strongly held views one way or the other.<br /><br />"Also unimpressive is the way Druid uses a tiny and disputed north Wales sample whereas my analysis was based on a nationwide poll."<br /><br />I qualified my post several times by saying I didn't think your hypothesis was true in North Wales. I think that's fair enough; the Druid mainly confines himself to Anglesey and North Wales matters.<br /><br />"They condemn themselves with their own words. The thread is full of bitterness and spite with barely a constructive word. Nobody is really interested in Plaid's fortunes (except perhaps the author) they just want to vent bile against the Welsh language and against the party."<br /><br />For my part I am interested in Plaid's fortunes because I would prefer the 'Party of Wales' & half coalition partner in Cardiff Bay to produce better thought out policies. I will add that I particularly enjoy reading John Dixon's blog and think that he is an absolute asset to Plaid.<br /><br />"It's complete nonsense that undermines the Druid's blog, as moronic comments once did on my blog. It barely deserves a reply but when my blog is linked to I usually try to reply."<br /><br />Again, I don't think censoring opinion is the way forward.Paul Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01021606156107333019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-31869328642905519852010-05-17T13:26:15.762+01:002010-05-17T13:26:15.762+01:00I found IWJ to be dismissive of a complaint that I...I found IWJ to be dismissive of a complaint that I brought to his attention, not because of language issues but I suspect because of who I was complaining about. IWJ's attitude changed markedly when the name of the person i was levelling a complaint about was mentioned.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-74672644692299518782010-05-17T12:46:19.472+01:002010-05-17T12:46:19.472+01:00Welsh Ramblings: You may have a point with your fi...Welsh Ramblings: You may have a point with your first paragraph. Your second paragraph , I think, misses the point. What I understood the post at 16.01 to be saying was that IWJ was dismissive (for whatever reason, though perceived to be because of lack of fluency in Welsh) not that he refused to speak English.<br /><br /><br />Nooka the PedantNookanoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-15659902422571164002010-05-17T11:14:47.661+01:002010-05-17T11:14:47.661+01:00They could be from anyone. There's no accounta...They could be from anyone. There's no accountability.<br /><br />They condemn themselves with their own words. The thread is full of bitterness and spite with barely a constructive word. Nobody is really interested in Plaid's fortunes (except perhaps the author) they just want to vent bile against the Welsh language and against the party.<br /><br />There is even a statement that Ieuan Wyn Jones, a man who has served Ynys Mon as both an AM and MP, a government Minister and Deputy First Minister of our nation, refused to address someone in the English language when he realised they could not speak Welsh. Think about what is being said for a moment. Jones has presided over meetings in the English language in public. <br /><br />It's complete nonsense that undermines the Druid's blog, as moronic comments once did on my blog. It barely deserves a reply but when my blog is linked to I usually try to reply.Welsh Ramblingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17585109264200933570noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-23085417183652724322010-05-17T11:01:08.549+01:002010-05-17T11:01:08.549+01:00Have you read all of the comments? Some are from W...Have you read all of the comments? Some are from Welsh born English speakers.<br /><br />How can they be xenophobic against their own countrymen??? or women.<br /><br />Address them first please.<br /><br />There are idiots everywhere; don't use them as an excuse to avoid the issue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-28963618347519895392010-05-17T08:52:48.404+01:002010-05-17T08:52:48.404+01:00You really attract some English xenophobes to this...You really attract some English xenophobes to this blog Druid, I reckon all of UKIP's vote on the Island are contributors. You'll get a reputation as a Little Englander yourself.La Pasionarianoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-75969314614825316502010-05-17T00:48:26.890+01:002010-05-17T00:48:26.890+01:00"Didn't take long for a Plaid analysis to..."Didn't take long for a Plaid analysis to descend into an anti-Welsh diatribe did it?<br />"<br /><br />No not anti welsh at all, everyone has the right to speak their own language just don't impose it on others if they don't want or can't speak itAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-26326207588818561242010-05-16T22:09:10.952+01:002010-05-16T22:09:10.952+01:00Didn't take long for a Plaid analysis to desce...Didn't take long for a Plaid analysis to descend into an anti-Welsh diatribe did it?<br /><br />This non-Welsh speaking blogger is far from impressed <br /><br />Also unimpressive is the way Druid uses a tiny and disputed north Wales sample whereas my analysis was based on a nationwide poll.Welsh Ramblingshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17585109264200933570noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-69334232508346440042010-05-16T17:23:04.879+01:002010-05-16T17:23:04.879+01:00Anon 15:51 If you believe that Plaid are there for...Anon 15:51 If you believe that Plaid are there for Welsh and English equally in Ynys Mon you are really gullible. I've had dealings with IWJ.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-22069289889498803292010-05-16T16:01:24.300+01:002010-05-16T16:01:24.300+01:00Well when I went to see IWJ about something, he st...Well when I went to see IWJ about something, he started speaking welsh to me when he realised I couldn't speak it I was out of his office in 5 minutes and never heard from him again, so to my mind they're notAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-54730865344847745702010-05-16T15:51:16.825+01:002010-05-16T15:51:16.825+01:00With regards Plaid and the language. I have alway...With regards Plaid and the language. I have always been told Plaid are there for both Wlesh and English, is that correct ?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-69347877693456148962010-05-16T15:01:30.670+01:002010-05-16T15:01:30.670+01:00Oh come off it
1. I didn't respond to your q...Oh come off it <br /><br />1. I didn't respond to your query regarding the margin of error of the polls because theres no point arguing about it. With the exception of the last poll conducted days before the election (which was reasonably accurate), neither you nor I could prove that the other polls were accurate or not. However, whatever the margin of error, Plaid consistently polled around 16-17% in Nov '09 and Jan '10 and then consistently polled at 10% from Mar '10 onwards. However you want to argue it, there was a drop in Plaid support between Jan and March.<br /><br />2. Again I never said Plaid's pensions pledge was 'cynical' because of the cost of the pledge - yet you keep bringing it up the costings comparison with the Lib Dem tax threshold policy. You are attacking a straw man you put up yourself. <br /><br />"They made small, carefully costed promises" - really? Why then was the pensions pledge later revised to only apply to those over 80 years of age? Not so carefully costed then perhaps.<br /><br />"Your argument that Plaid shouldn't say anything because they might not be in a position to do it is bonkers. No point in them having elections in Northern Ireland then."<br /><br />In my original post I suggested that Plaid restricted their election pledges to devolved powers - rather than making rather silly national pledges that they could never possibly implement. That doesn't seem unreasonable to me.<br /><br />3. Yes.Paul Williamshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01021606156107333019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-43933241117024981532010-05-16T13:52:21.817+01:002010-05-16T13:52:21.817+01:00@The Druid of Anglesey
1. No response to the ques...@The Druid of Anglesey<br /><br />1. No response to the question about the margin of error for the North Wales crosstabs in the YouGov survey then?<br /><br />Shall we just agree that it's pretty large and makes your tables meaningless.<br /><br />As that's the basis for your claim that Plaid suffered a significant drop in support before the leadership debates then perhaps you'd like to re-assess that claim.<br /><br />2. The Lib Dem comparison was to make the point that Plaid's pension policy was no sort of unattainable promise. It was costed and far more realistic than that of the Lib Dems.<br /><br />If Plaid were being cynical then they could say anything in their manifesto. They didn't. They made small, carefully costed promises that would have figured in negotiations and will, in any case, be pursued by the MPs elected. That's not being cynical, that's being as honest as you can get when it comes to implementing policy.<br /><br />Just to remind, <br /><br />pensions policy = change of less than 0.5% in UK expenditure, paid for by harmonising CGT with income tax.<br /><br />additional £300m for Wales = identified deficit in Welsh budget by independent report, 0.05% of UK expenditure.<br /><br />Hardly pie in the sky, is it?<br /><br />Your argument that Plaid shouldn't say anything because they might not be in a position to do it is bonkers. No point in them having elections in Northern Ireland then.<br /><br />3. The reference to the WM article is because it's the one that you quote. But are you seriously suggesting that a few pieces on Plaid Cymru pensions policy had more effect than 4 and a half hours of leadership debates and acres of press coverage before and afterwards? And led to a 30% drop in Plaid support several months later but at the same time as the leadership debates.<br /><br />Oh, come off it...oh, come off itnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6130000348899973408.post-30213753097592826302010-05-16T13:35:54.836+01:002010-05-16T13:35:54.836+01:00I have every sympathy Anon 13:02
An indication of...I have every sympathy Anon 13:02<br /><br />An indication of how many people are able to fully function through the medium of Welsh and who wish to do so can be gleaned from the 2001 census.<br /><br />Enumerators went from door to door offering either Welsh or English versions of the Census form. 1,720,000 forms were handed out and of those, 43,800 Welsh versions were returned. 2.54% of all households had someone who could fill in a form in Welsh and wished to do so in preference to English.<br /><br />The Welsh Language "Industry" is a bully in Wales. Every Non-welsh speaker is supposed to apologise for not being able to speak Welsh. Government in the Assembly is terrified of being branded "Anti-Welsh" by Plaid and their off shoot Cymdeithas Yr Iaith. As a result we have people like "Gareth" above who thinks that any criticism of the outrageous behaviour of the language elite can be deflected by accusing someone with "Hating Welsh" or "Hating Welsh speakers".<br /><br />It's OK to say I don't speak Welsh and I don't care. It's also alright to pull back the fig leaf of "Saving the language" to reveal the unpleasantness beneath.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com