Alicia Keys sang a North Wales adaptation of her "Empire State of Mind" hit on Chris Moyles Breakfast Show today in advance of appearing at the Radio 1 Big Weekend in Bangor this weekend:
To place roof above o as in 'ô' use alt+0244 (will not work in all applications), or do what I do and select and copy from character map.
See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ynys_M%C3%B4n_%28Anglesey%29 for explanation of islands name.
Following above comment - Island of Ynys Môn would be 'Island of the Island of Môn'.
There is as the BBC programme 'QI' pointed out examples of duplicate names out there i.e Avon River meaning River River (interestingly a rare example of a welsh word being adopted by the English language - Afon = river).
Hello 14.57 The easiest way is to prep your blog in word. Get the accent you want (with the appropriate letter) click Insert, drop down Symbols and they are all there. When you have the blog copy and past it Voila.
Silly because Anglesey mean 'Ongul's Island' (ey=island), so Isle of Anglesey is 'Isle of Ongull's Island'. And it historically has never been known as isle of Anglesey, no-one calls it Isle of Anglesey, it is a mouthful.
Of your examples, only Anglesey ends with -ey.
Having said that, Ramsey in south Wales is called 'Ramsey Island'
Another bugbear of mine (sorry, even more off topic) is the lack of an English name for Hafod Eyri due to the reason that 'there isn't a comparable English word'.
Well there are plenty of them, a perfect translation would be 'Snowdon Shieling'.
shiel·ing (shlng, -ln) n. Chiefly British 1. A shepherd's hut. 2. A mountain pasture used in the summer.
As Anglesey is / was known as "Môn Mam Cymry" Anglesey was known as Mam Cymru ('Mother of Wales') during the middle ages because its fertile fields formed the breadbasket for the north of Wales (from 'History of Wales')
I think it is significant that Môn remains independant and is not stirred into the same pot as the other electoral districts. After all we are unique apart from some thinning down by incomers from other countries.
I am not being racist but being from an historic 'island familiy' believe we are 'Anglesey' in the same way a nationalistic person would (obviously) uphold their national identity.
From http://www.davidkfaux.org/Cimbri-Chronology.pdf
"There is, however, a possibility that the findings of the above markers (along with the classic R1a1-M17 Viking Y – chromosome marker) and others (e.g., I-M223) possibly associated with the Germanics may reflect actual Viking settlement in Anglesey from the 9th Century. Onguls is associated by tradition as a Scandinavian name and why the name would remain thus rather than the original Celtic “Mons” if not a Germanic colony makes little sense. The name very likely means “Isle of the Angles” since early documentary sources indicated that the Northumbrian Angles took over this territory sometime after the 5th Century, and the author calls the Angles “Onghuls” (Ninnius, 1016). In addition, there have been a series of recent archaeological discoveries of Angle (see earlier noted study by present author) as well as Viking settlements – more evidence than in most of the Danelaw - that is requiring a re-evaluation of how much Scandinavian settlement actually occurred here. The best source for an evaluation of available evidence is Mark Redknap, “Vikings in Wales: An Archaeological Quest” (2000). He makes a very sound argument for Danish Viking (hence possibly Cimbri) settlement on Anglesey. Hence the population here may be a combination of Anglian and Viking as well as aboriginal people."
For those trying to determine the origins of Môn, perhaps it came from the latin Mons. Anglesey is certainly a 'lump' or 'mound'. I have no intention of getting subscribers overexcited but if you look up things like Mons Veneris, Mons Pubis, Mons Venus you will get my meaning. Perhaps that is what the Romans left us with! A mound with trees on it.
We learn something new everyday... I supposed Bardsey Island (Ynys Enlli) off the Llyn Peninsular means "Bard Island Island". What does the "Bard" part mean?
PLEASE NOTE: The following kinds of comments will be deleted: -comments which contain unfounded allegations against named persons (however obliquely they are referred to); - comments which threaten violence or are unduly offensive; - multiple, identical 'spam' posts on one or various threads.
Wow! Clive, I'll drop the case if you let me have your VIP back stage pass.
ReplyDeleteAnd the pages of Anglesey and Gwynedd Council's web sites say what about this lovely tribute to our area?
ReplyDeleteNOT A DICKY BIRD!
Time to sack the lot of them, particularly Economic Develpment, who couldn't grab an opportunity if it glued itself to their ugly faces.
What a total disgrace. Well done BBC Radio 1!
Just brilliant!
ReplyDeleteSays it all re local transport though - the lyric line @ 4.33 "take the A55 ... ... it's all accessible as long as you have a car"
I prefer 'Mona' by Bo Diddley myself.
ReplyDeleteThat 'Isle of...' is ridiculous though.
Next, it will become known as 'The Island of Ynys Mon'
Just Call it Mon! or Anglesey! Twerps
"Just Call it Mon! or Anglesey! Twerps "
ReplyDeleteYay! I knew I'd find another person who thinks the 'Isle of Anglesey' is stupid. And liguistically wrong.
err.... why is Isle of Anglesey linguistically wrong?
ReplyDeletePersonally I prefer Ynys Mon, though I wish I knew where how to type the circumflex in Mon on my keyboard. :-)
Yes, I'd like to know why too.
ReplyDeleteIsle of Wight
Isle of Man
Isle of Skye
Isle of Arran
Isle of Anglesey
....
To place roof above o as in 'ô' use alt+0244 (will not work in all applications), or do what I do and select and copy from character map.
ReplyDeleteSee http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ynys_M%C3%B4n_%28Anglesey%29 for explanation of islands name.
Following above comment - Island of Ynys Môn would be 'Island of the Island of Môn'.
There is as the BBC programme 'QI' pointed out examples of duplicate names out there i.e Avon River meaning River River (interestingly a rare example of a welsh word being adopted by the English language - Afon = river).
Hello 14.57
ReplyDeleteThe easiest way is to prep your blog in word.
Get the accent you want (with the appropriate letter) click Insert, drop down Symbols and they are all there. When you have the blog copy and past it Voila.
George
Ynys Môn
Silly because Anglesey mean 'Ongul's Island' (ey=island), so Isle of Anglesey is 'Isle of Ongull's Island'. And it historically has never been known as isle of Anglesey, no-one calls it Isle of Anglesey, it is a mouthful.
ReplyDeleteOf your examples, only Anglesey ends with -ey.
Having said that, Ramsey in south Wales is called 'Ramsey Island'
Silly as 'Isle of Ynys Môn'
I cut and paste my ô from George :)
Plus, it was "Môn, Mother of Wales", not "Ynys Môn, Mother of Wales"
ReplyDeleteYnys Môn sounds best in Welsh, Anglesey in English. 3 syllables each. fair.
ReplyDeleteI guess Isle of Môn is out of the question.
ReplyDeletePity you can't edit posts.
ReplyDeleteIf was was simply known as Môn in both languages (my preference), think how big it would be on the map!
Another bugbear of mine (sorry, even more off topic) is the lack of an English name for Hafod Eyri due to the reason that 'there isn't a comparable English word'.
ReplyDeleteWell there are plenty of them, a perfect translation would be 'Snowdon Shieling'.
shiel·ing (shlng, -ln)
n. Chiefly British
1. A shepherd's hut.
2. A mountain pasture used in the summer.
"err.... why is Isle of Anglesey linguistically wrong?"
ReplyDeleteSomeone beat me to it, but are spot-on in their explanation. The Isle of Onguls' Island. Great!
As Anglesey is / was known as "Môn Mam Cymry"
ReplyDeleteAnglesey was known as Mam Cymru ('Mother of Wales') during the middle ages because its fertile fields formed the breadbasket for the north of Wales (from 'History of Wales')
I think it is significant that Môn remains independant and is not stirred into the same pot as the other electoral districts. After all we are unique apart from some thinning down by incomers from other countries.
I am not being racist but being from an historic 'island familiy' believe we are 'Anglesey' in the same way a nationalistic person would (obviously) uphold their national identity.
George
From http://www.davidkfaux.org/Cimbri-Chronology.pdf
ReplyDelete"There is, however, a possibility that the findings of the above markers (along with the
classic R1a1-M17 Viking Y – chromosome marker) and others (e.g., I-M223) possibly
associated with the Germanics may reflect actual Viking settlement in Anglesey from the
9th Century. Onguls is associated by tradition as a Scandinavian name and why the name
would remain thus rather than the original Celtic “Mons” if not a Germanic colony makes
little sense. The name very likely means “Isle of the Angles” since early documentary
sources indicated that the Northumbrian Angles took over this territory sometime after
the 5th Century, and the author calls the Angles “Onghuls” (Ninnius, 1016). In addition,
there have been a series of recent archaeological discoveries of Angle (see earlier noted study by present author) as well as Viking settlements – more evidence than in most of the Danelaw - that is requiring a re-evaluation of how much Scandinavian settlement actually occurred here. The best source for an evaluation of available evidence is Mark Redknap, “Vikings in Wales: An Archaeological Quest” (2000). He makes a very sound argument for Danish Viking (hence possibly Cimbri) settlement on Anglesey. Hence the population here may be a combination of Anglian and Viking as well as aboriginal
people."
So no one really knows the origin of Ongulls/Onghuls, but the -ey means 'island', which is undisputed and the point being made.
ReplyDeleteTo my knowledge, other -ey names are personal (Bermondsey, Ramsey) not racial.
For those trying to determine the origins of Môn,
ReplyDeleteperhaps it came from the latin Mons. Anglesey is certainly a 'lump' or 'mound'. I have no intention of getting subscribers overexcited but if you look up things like Mons Veneris, Mons Pubis, Mons Venus you will get my meaning. Perhaps that is what the Romans left us with! A mound with trees on it.
George
We learn something new everyday... I supposed Bardsey Island (Ynys Enlli) off the Llyn Peninsular means "Bard Island Island". What does the "Bard" part mean?
ReplyDeleteThe Ordovices never wrote in words, therefore the Roman name "Mona" is probably the earliest known name.
ReplyDeleteWhy not rename it Mongolsey.
He he. You know what would happen then? It would tranfiguremorphosiseate into:
ReplyDeleteThe Isle of Mongolsey Council !
This is a concise and pretty reliable account:
http://www.earlybritishkingdoms.com/archaeology/bardsey.html
Wehey! Anglesey Council must have read this thread, because they now have the festival as their number one headline on the homepage!
ReplyDeleteAnother success for Druid's blog!
IS THIS LEGAL?
ReplyDeleteI've been told that your not allowed to bring your own refreshments and you will have to pay about £4 for a bottle of water.
Legal yes
ReplyDeleteMoral no
and n'er the twain shall meet
;-)
Smugglers rule OK?